"Question of the Week: With roughly 25,000 seats available at
Cleveland this year, how did CART manage to stuff the claimed 51,000
attendees into them? And no, the general admission walk-arounds did
not equal the number of people in the grandstands. By the way, if
you ever wanted to be the promoter of a CART race, now may be the
time. We’re told that a call to IMG’s Bud Stanner could get you an
unbelievable friendly deal on their Cleveland contract, and maybe
even a little cash."
(from RaceFax.com)
Gary
"Arguing on the internet is like running in the
Special Olympics. Even if you do win, you’re still
retarded."
"Gary Ghezzi" wrote:
> "Question of the Week: With roughly 25,000 seats available at
> Cleveland this year, how did CART manage to stuff the claimed 51,000
> attendees into them? And no, the general admission walk-arounds did
> not equal the number of people in the grandstands. By the way, if
> you ever wanted to be the promoter of a CART race, now may be the
> time. We’re told that a call to IMG’s Bud Stanner could get you an
> unbelievable friendly deal on their Cleveland contract, and maybe
> even a little cash."
> (from RaceFax.com)
You’ve got a lot of damn nerve, Mac, quoting repeatedly from a garbage
source like RaceFax.com after all the trashing you’ve done to
autoracing1.com. (And you actually *pay* to be lied to. Not even the
old AR1 readers are doing that.) Consistency is not one of your
stronger points.
Doug
"Doug Ashford" <dashf…@prodigy.net> wrote in message
news:3D3579EB.A18FCE5C@prodigy.net…
> You’ve got a lot of damn nerve, Mac, quoting repeatedly from a garbage
> source like RaceFax.com after all the trashing you’ve done to
> autoracing1.com. (And you actually *pay* to be lied to. Not even the
> old AR1 readers are doing that.) Consistency is not one of your
> stronger points.
> Doug
Killfile him Doug and be done with it. Don’t feed the trolls, leave them be
and they’ll starve to death.
Mike
Mike wrote:
> "Doug Ashford" <dashf…@prodigy.net> wrote in message
> news:3D3579EB.A18FCE5C@prodigy.net…
> > You’ve got a lot of damn nerve, Mac, quoting repeatedly from a garbage
> > source like RaceFax.com after all the trashing you’ve done to
> > autoracing1.com. (And you actually *pay* to be lied to. Not even the
> > old AR1 readers are doing that.) Consistency is not one of your
> > stronger points.
> > Doug
> Killfile him Doug and be done with it. Don’t feed the trolls, leave them be
> and they’ll starve to death.
Not to start a new thread here, but I’ve read this time and again, and
you know there’s absolutely no evidence this is true. There are
anti-IRL trolls and anti-CART trolls that have been here for years. You
can blame the people who "feed" them, if you like, but the fact is
they’re here, their thoughts are queer — get used to it.
Doug
>Subject: Re: And on the subject of Cleveland attendance
>From: Doug Ashford dashf…@prodigy.net
>You
>can blame the people who "feed" them, if you like, but the fact is
>they’re here, their thoughts are queer — get used to it.
"La-la-la-la-la-la, I can’t hear you, la-la-la."
-Pee Wee Herman
Tententhsinc wrote:
> >Subject: Re: And on the subject of Cleveland attendance
> >From: Doug Ashford dashf…@prodigy.net
> >You
> >can blame the people who "feed" them, if you like, but the fact is
> >they’re here, their thoughts are queer — get used to it.
> "La-la-la-la-la-la, I can’t hear you, la-la-la."
> -Pee Wee Herman
As usual, you missed the point completely.
Doug
"Gary Ghezzi" <gghe…@NOSPAMyahoo.com> wrote in message
news:3d361f75.84731577@news-east.teranews.com…
> "Question of the Week: With roughly 25,000 seats available at
> Cleveland this year, how did CART manage to stuff the claimed 51,000
> attendees into them? And no, the general admission walk-arounds did
> not equal the number of people in the grandstands. By the way, if
> you ever wanted to be the promoter of a CART race, now may be the
> time. We’re told that a call to IMG’s Bud Stanner could get you an
> unbelievable friendly deal on their Cleveland contract, and maybe
> even a little cash."
Ask David Reininger, he’s good at counting seats at Cleveland.
Fred Mertz wrote:
> "Gary Ghezzi" <gghe…@NOSPAMyahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:3d361f75.84731577@news-east.teranews.com…
> > "Question of the Week: With roughly 25,000 seats available at
> > Cleveland this year, how did CART manage to stuff the claimed 51,000
> > attendees into them? And no, the general admission walk-arounds did
> > not equal the number of people in the grandstands. By the way, if
> > you ever wanted to be the promoter of a CART race, now may be the
> > time. We’re told that a call to IMG’s Bud Stanner could get you an
> > unbelievable friendly deal on their Cleveland contract, and maybe
> > even a little cash."
> Ask David Reininger, he’s good at counting seats at Cleveland.
I see that my count has made it to several media outlets. Now that we’ve
established
a seat count of 25,000, which is much closer to the 21,480 I counted,
perhaps we
can start talking about the empty seats on race day.
Let me know if you will needs photos, I’ll be happy to upload them.
"Fred Mertz" <f…@mertz.com> wrote in message
news:4YrZ8.143665$q53.3497424@twister.austin.rr.com…
> Ask David Reininger, he’s good at counting seats at Cleveland.
No he’s not,… *L*
In article <4YrZ8.143665$q53.3497…@twister.austin.rr.com>,
Fred Mertz <f…@mertz.com> wrote:
>"Gary Ghezzi" <gghe…@NOSPAMyahoo.com> wrote in message
>news:3d361f75.84731577@news-east.teranews.com…
>> "Question of the Week: With roughly 25,000 seats available at
>> Cleveland this year, how did CART manage to stuff the claimed 51,000
>> attendees into them? And no, the general admission walk-arounds did
>> not equal the number of people in the grandstands. By the way, if
>> you ever wanted to be the promoter of a CART race, now may be the
>> time. We’re told that a call to IMG’s Bud Stanner could get you an
>> unbelievable friendly deal on their Cleveland contract, and maybe
>> even a little cash."
>Ask David Reininger, he’s good at counting seats at Cleveland.
Poor old Dave never could count past twenty, now could he?
Dave swore that the numbers added up to 18,000 two years ago. He also
claimed that there were 20 seats per section in each stand and
specifically claimed just 2000 seats in stand J. He based his
entire "count" around those figures.
I proved him wrong two years ago, but he would never admit it. The
proof is all laid out on Google groups if anyone cares to look – just
search for "Got them can’t count past 20 blues". Of course now he’s
using the 20/40/40/20 seats per section number that he refused to admit
was correct two years ago. So I guess I’ll accept that as an admission
of his error.
Maybe now that CART has taken out at least three stands he’s got it
right. I wouldn’t count on it since every stand but "K" has more than
20 rows and we know what a puzzle that is for him.
The irony here is that CART’s detractors claim on a regular basis that
CART’s street races are attended by event goers rather than racing fans,
yet they dismiss the possibility of a large general admission and
hospitality crowd because they’re not "lined up at the
fence".
Make no mistake, the crowd was smaller this year and CART has some
rebuilding to do in Cleveland, but Dave gave up his integrity on the
attendance issue long ago.
–
N. Richard Caldwell
Lucent Technologies
n…@lucent.com
<n…@cbemi.cb.lucent.com> wrote in message
news:ah9gbm$5i2@nntpa.cb.lucent.com…
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
> In article <4YrZ8.143665$q53.3497…@twister.austin.rr.com>,
> Fred Mertz <f…@mertz.com> wrote:
> >"Gary Ghezzi" <gghe…@NOSPAMyahoo.com> wrote in message
> >news:3d361f75.84731577@news-east.teranews.com…
> >> "Question of the Week: With roughly 25,000 seats available at
> >> Cleveland this year, how did CART manage to stuff the claimed 51,000
> >> attendees into them? And no, the general admission walk-arounds did
> >> not equal the number of people in the grandstands. By the way, if
> >> you ever wanted to be the promoter of a CART race, now may be the
> >> time. We’re told that a call to IMG’s Bud Stanner could get you an
> >> unbelievable friendly deal on their Cleveland contract, and maybe
> >> even a little cash."
> >Ask David Reininger, he’s good at counting seats at Cleveland.
> Poor old Dave never could count past twenty, now could he?
> Dave swore that the numbers added up to 18,000 two years ago. He also
> claimed that there were 20 seats per section in each stand and
> specifically claimed just 2000 seats in stand J. He based his
> entire "count" around those figures.
> I proved him wrong two years ago, but he would never admit it. The
> proof is all laid out on Google groups if anyone cares to look – just
> search for "Got them can’t count past 20 blues". Of course now he’s
> using the 20/40/40/20 seats per section number that he refused to admit
> was correct two years ago. So I guess I’ll accept that as an admission
> of his error.
> Maybe now that CART has taken out at least three stands he’s got it
> right. I wouldn’t count on it since every stand but "K" has more than
> 20 rows and we know what a puzzle that is for him.
> The irony here is that CART’s detractors claim on a regular basis that
> CART’s street races are attended by event goers rather than racing fans,
> yet they dismiss the possibility of a large general admission and
> hospitality crowd because they’re not "lined up at the
> fence".
> Make no mistake, the crowd was smaller this year and CART has some
> rebuilding to do in Cleveland, but Dave gave up his integrity on the
> attendance issue long ago.
> —
> N. Richard Caldwell
> Lucent Technologies
> n…@lucent.com
Dude you might want to get ahold of ESPN. They just printed Dave’s info as
fact. Apparently no one at ESPN looks at the bullshit he spews here or they
would not have even read his email.
Dave
I spent the weekend at Cleveland & I thought the place was fairly well
atttended both Saturday & Sunday. We camped along the fence just past
turn 11 (20 feet from the track, unbelievable !) along w/ about 50
other motorhomes. There were another 100 or so motorhomes parked in
the traditional camping area that was not along the fence.
I knew I saw motorhomes there during the Trans Am race.
Dave must have thought they were under the bleachers.
Dave
Joe Weissmann <weissmjnremovet…@ucmail.uc.edu> wrote in message
news:3d3862c1.3460160@news.ececs.uc.edu…
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
> I spent the weekend at Cleveland & I thought the place was fairly well
> atttended both Saturday & Sunday. We camped along the fence just past
> turn 11 (20 feet from the track, unbelievable !) along w/ about 50
> other motorhomes. There were another 100 or so motorhomes parked in
> the traditional camping area that was not along the fence.
Joe, how much did it cost to park there?
Was it one charge for the whole weekend?
Could you leave and come back? Or were you stuck there once you arrived?
Did you have to have a "camper" to park there? Or could you have pickups
with tents?
Just curious — because I was going to give that try next year.
How was the view? I never walked all the way down there (it’s a haul) but it
looked like a pretty good vantage point as long as you were elevated a
little bit.
Tx J.L.
"Joe Weissmann" <weissmjnremovet…@ucmail.uc.edu> wrote in message
news:3d3862c1.3460160@news.ececs.uc.edu…
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
> I spent the weekend at Cleveland & I thought the place was fairly well
> atttended both Saturday & Sunday. We camped along the fence just past
> turn 11 (20 feet from the track, unbelievable !) along w/ about 50
> other motorhomes. There were another 100 or so motorhomes parked in
> the traditional camping area that was not along the fence.
"DAVID J ROBINSON" <robinsonspamfam…@prodig.net> wrote in message
news:YKXZ8.9873$1%3.512964635@newssvr17.news.prodigy.com…
> Dude you might want to get ahold of ESPN. They just printed Dave’s info as
> fact. Apparently no one at ESPN looks at the bullshit he spews here or
they
> would not have even read his email.
It’s sickening,..
They just posted Reningers "article" on TSN as fact as well,.. Not opinion,
but as an ARTICLE,…
how in the HELL does an IRL spotter/shill get ANYTHING posted on ANY
reliable news outlet?….
http://www.tsn.ca/racing/readstory.asp?story_id=2428582
Makes me want to puke.
On Sat, 20 Jul 2002 00:53:32 GMT, "Jason Hoehn"
<jasonho…@shaw.ca.nosmap> wrote:
[snip]
>how in the HELL does an IRL spotter/shill get ANYTHING posted on ANY
>reliable news outlet?….
[snip]
He’s a well respected motor racing journalist. Was that long before
he started spotting. At the track, he’s still primarily a journalist.
As far as shill goes… if anything, he’s a shill for motor racing.
All of it. That he has become disillusioned with CART says there is
something very wrong with CART.
On Sat, 20 Jul 2002 02:15:33 GMT, Ken Plotkin <kplot…@nospam-cox.net> wrote:
> He’s a well respected motor racing journalist.
BAWAHAHAHAHA
The same DR who writes his crap we have been reading for years? You *MUST*
be kidding or totally sloshed. That is some sick joke.
Bob
Ken does Robin Miller hang out here slinging shit about the IRL or CART?
Does any Sports Jounralist with the exception of Dave do it? Sorry you may
say he is respected, but most of his peers would not waste thier time here,
him doing so only makes him look like a shill.
Dave
Ken Plotkin <kplot…@nospam-cox.net> wrote in message
news:2hhhjucilvq1oi541ea5j3297n8darhknu@4ax.com…
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
> On Sat, 20 Jul 2002 00:53:32 GMT, "Jason Hoehn"
> <jasonho…@shaw.ca.nosmap> wrote:
> [snip]
> >how in the HELL does an IRL spotter/shill get ANYTHING posted on ANY
> >reliable news outlet?….
> [snip]
> He’s a well respected motor racing journalist. Was that long before
> he started spotting. At the track, he’s still primarily a journalist.
> As far as shill goes… if anything, he’s a shill for motor racing.
> All of it. That he has become disillusioned with CART says there is
> something very wrong with CART.
On Sat, 20 Jul 2002 02:30:43 GMT, DAVID J ROBINSON wrote:
> Ken does Robin Miller hang out here slinging shit about the IRL or CART?
> Does any Sports Jounralist with the exception of Dave do it? Sorry you may
> say he is respected, but most of his peers would not waste thier time here,
> him doing so only makes him look like a shill.
Ken does CART have former team owners hanging out here slinging under numerous
bogus names or assuming the identity of other posters for the purpose of
disharmony or slander? Does CART have track owners fixing races to suit their
agendas? What racing series has drivers bitch slapping their ex stripper GF’s
and dumping them by the side of the road only to receive a pass on the promise
that I will try harder in the future. Only in the gIRLs do you find such
antics. Then there is the gIRLS *MOST* popular driver, drum roll please,
SARAH FISHER!!! Good grief.
Bob
> Ken does CART have former team owners hanging out here slinging under
numerous
> bogus names or assuming the identity of other posters for the purpose of
> disharmony or slander? Does CART have track owners fixing races to suit
their
> agendas? What racing series has drivers bitch slapping their ex stripper
GF’s
> and dumping them by the side of the road only to receive a pass on the
promise
> that I will try harder in the future. Only in the gIRLs do you find such
> antics. Then there is the gIRLS *MOST* popular driver, drum roll please,
> SARAH FISHER!!! Good grief.
brutal, but ever so accurate….
On Sat, 20 Jul 2002 02:30:43 GMT, "DAVID J ROBINSON"
<robinsonspamfam…@prodig.net> wrote:
>Ken does Robin Miller hang out here slinging shit about the IRL or CART?
>Does any Sports Jounralist with the exception of Dave do it? Sorry you may
>say he is respected, but most of his peers would not waste thier time here,
>him doing so only makes him look like a shill.
Everyone needs a hobby.
There are more journalists (including award-winning ones) hanging out
here than you might think.
If Robin Miller had hung out here, doing *anything* instead of the
on-line activities he actually engaged in, he’d still have his job at
the Star.
Ken Plotkin
"DAVID J ROBINSON" <robinsonspamfam…@prodig.net> wrote in message
news:nX3_8.709$qg2.104033639@newssvr15.news.prodigy.com…
> Ken does Robin Miller hang out here slinging shit about the IRL or CART?
> Does any Sports Jounralist with the exception of Dave do it? Sorry you
may
> say he is respected, but most of his peers would not waste thier time
here,
> him doing so only makes him look like a shill.
*L*,. that’s the thing,.. how can ANYONE be ANY kind of "respected"
journalist when most of his writings are flaming a racing series and it’s
fans on a PUBLIC NG. Thats about as unprofessional as you can get. There’s
keeping in touch with the common fan, and then theres being a goofball and
making an ass out of yourself publicly. Hell, try to keep away from RASI out
of respect of the IRL fans opinions, and I’m NOT a "journalist"… I’m just
some guy.
Jeez, even Alan Pagan doesn’t post stuff on RASI anymore. I think he
realized that people "inside" the buisness need to keep a professional
distance to keep credibility. It’s pretty sad actually. I at LEAST wouldn’t
have had a problem with that article if it was posted as an editorial, and
not as a news article. it was all opinion and skewed fact. That’s not news,
that’s a personal opinion. And posting stuff like that as news is what burns
me. DR can post all of the rah-rah IRL rhetoric he likes, IF it gets it
posted as an editorial. When you post your opinion as news, there is
something very very wrong. But then again journalism and the media has been
doing that since they began, so I shouldn’t expect anything any different.
BTW, i just noticed that TSN has pulled the article, and has pulled all
links to the article very very soon after posting it. Hummm,.. Maybe TSN
does atctually have some integrity after all.
BTW,.. is anyone ELSE getting SICK of all the crossposting lately?.. I mean
on either group??? … (and yeah, i realize this is crossposted…)
"Jason Hoehn" <jasonho…@shaw.ca.nosmap> wrote in message
news:s%7_8.14784$v53.753740@news3.calgary.shaw.ca…
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
> "DAVID J ROBINSON" <robinsonspamfam…@prodig.net> wrote in message
> news:nX3_8.709$qg2.104033639@newssvr15.news.prodigy.com…
> > Ken does Robin Miller hang out here slinging shit about the IRL or CART?
> > Does any Sports Jounralist with the exception of Dave do it? Sorry you
> may
> > say he is respected, but most of his peers would not waste thier time
> here,
> > him doing so only makes him look like a shill.
> *L*,. that’s the thing,.. how can ANYONE be ANY kind of "respected"
> journalist when most of his writings are flaming a racing series and it’s
> fans on a PUBLIC NG. Thats about as unprofessional as you can get. There’s
> keeping in touch with the common fan, and then theres being a goofball and
> making an ass out of yourself publicly. Hell, try to keep away from RASI
out
> of respect of the IRL fans opinions, and I’m NOT a "journalist"… I’m
just
> some guy.
> Jeez, even Alan Pagan doesn’t post stuff on RASI anymore. I think he
> realized that people "inside" the buisness need to keep a professional
> distance to keep credibility. It’s pretty sad actually. I at LEAST
wouldn’t
> have had a problem with that article if it was posted as an editorial, and
> not as a news article. it was all opinion and skewed fact. That’s not
news,
> that’s a personal opinion. And posting stuff like that as news is what
burns
> me. DR can post all of the rah-rah IRL rhetoric he likes, IF it gets it
> posted as an editorial. When you post your opinion as news, there is
> something very very wrong. But then again journalism and the media has
been
> doing that since they began, so I shouldn’t expect anything any different.
> BTW, i just noticed that TSN has pulled the article, and has pulled all
> links to the article very very soon after posting it. Hummm,.. Maybe TSN
> does atctually have some integrity after all.
> BTW,.. is anyone ELSE getting SICK of all the crossposting lately?.. I
mean
> on either group??? … (and yeah, i realize this is crossposted…)
I’ve met and enjoyed the company of Rosie Di Manno and Christy Blatchford,
two women who were, and still can be, excellent high calibre journalists in
sport, but write about other things as well, such as covering intense court
cases, or as Rosie did today, smoking hash in Amsterdam. He’s not even in
the league. The main reason is due to the fact that they have the ability
to even cover what they dislike without a editorial view on the subject at
hand, but look at it from an outlook that gives the reader a feeling of
being there, not just reporting bland facts like he does, and certainly not
slamming in an opinionated way.
TC
As a race who has attended just about all of the Cleveland races, I can
honestly say that the attendance is nowhere near what is used to be there.
Mr. Reininger is pretty darn close.
Call him what you will, but he knows of what he speaks.
"David Reininger" <drein…@gmu.edu> wrote in message
news:3D36B56A.789BA8D8@gmu.edu…
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
> Fred Mertz wrote:
> > "Gary Ghezzi" <gghe…@NOSPAMyahoo.com> wrote in message
> > news:3d361f75.84731577@news-east.teranews.com…
> > > "Question of the Week: With roughly 25,000 seats available at
> > > Cleveland this year, how did CART manage to stuff the claimed 51,000
> > > attendees into them? And no, the general admission walk-arounds did
> > > not equal the number of people in the grandstands. By the way, if
> > > you ever wanted to be the promoter of a CART race, now may be the
> > > time. We’re told that a call to IMG’s Bud Stanner could get you an
> > > unbelievable friendly deal on their Cleveland contract, and maybe
> > > even a little cash."
> > Ask David Reininger, he’s good at counting seats at Cleveland.
> I see that my count has made it to several media outlets. Now that we’ve
> established
> a seat count of 25,000, which is much closer to the 21,480 I counted,
> perhaps we
> can start talking about the empty seats on race day.
> Let me know if you will needs photos, I’ll be happy to upload them.
<n…@cbemi.cb.lucent.com> wrote in message
news:ah9gbm$5i2@nntpa.cb.lucent.com…
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
> In article <4YrZ8.143665$q53.3497…@twister.austin.rr.com>,
> Fred Mertz <f…@mertz.com> wrote:
> >"Gary Ghezzi" <gghe…@NOSPAMyahoo.com> wrote in message
> >news:3d361f75.84731577@news-east.teranews.com…
> >> "Question of the Week: With roughly 25,000 seats available at
> >> Cleveland this year, how did CART manage to stuff the claimed 51,000
> >> attendees into them? And no, the general admission walk-arounds did
> >> not equal the number of people in the grandstands. By the way, if
> >> you ever wanted to be the promoter of a CART race, now may be the
> >> time. We’re told that a call to IMG’s Bud Stanner could get you an
> >> unbelievable friendly deal on their Cleveland contract, and maybe
> >> even a little cash."
> >Ask David Reininger, he’s good at counting seats at Cleveland.
> Poor old Dave never could count past twenty, now could he?
> Dave swore that the numbers added up to 18,000 two years ago. He also
> claimed that there were 20 seats per section in each stand and
> specifically claimed just 2000 seats in stand J. He based his
> entire "count" around those figures.
> I proved him wrong two years ago, but he would never admit it. The
> proof is all laid out on Google groups if anyone cares to look – just
> search for "Got them can’t count past 20 blues". Of course now he’s
> using the 20/40/40/20 seats per section number that he refused to admit
> was correct two years ago. So I guess I’ll accept that as an admission
> of his error.
> Maybe now that CART has taken out at least three stands he’s got it
> right. I wouldn’t count on it since every stand but "K" has more than
> 20 rows and we know what a puzzle that is for him.
> The irony here is that CART’s detractors claim on a regular basis that
> CART’s street races are attended by event goers rather than racing fans,
> yet they dismiss the possibility of a large general admission and
> hospitality crowd because they’re not "lined up at the
> fence".
> Make no mistake, the crowd was smaller this year and CART has some
> rebuilding to do in Cleveland,
Now there is a statement that I can agree with, but why would they have to
do this N. Richard?
but Dave gave up his integrity on the
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
> attendance issue long ago.
> —
> N. Richard Caldwell
> Lucent Technologies
> n…@lucent.com
<his crap snipped>
From http://www.rockingham.co.uk
ROCKINGHAM 500 RACE WILL GO AHEAD, PLEDGES TRACK BOSS
Following today’s announcement that the Eurospeedway Lausitz track will not
be hosting a German round of the FedEx CART Championship racing series this
year, David Grace the Chief Executive of Rockingham Motor Speedway pledged
that the British race will go ahead on September 14. The race on the banked
1.5-mile oval track near Corby in Northamptonshire last year attracted over
42,000 spectators to see the fastest motor race in Europe.
"I feel very sorry for all the team at EuroSpeedway Lausitz" said Grace. "I
know from our own experience just how hard they will have worked to try to
make the race a success. It is a tragedy that the German government
officials were unable to offer financial support to this a world-class
event. On the brighter side, as the sole venue in Europe this year, for the
fastest racing in the world, we are already making plans with CART and
EuroSpeedway to be able to welcome many of the German race fans to
Rockingham instead."
Rockingham’s plans are forging ahead, with over half the seats in one of the
track’s biggest grandstands allocated in the past fortnight alone and less
than a dozen of the track’s 58 corporate hospitality suites remaining. The
52,000 place, all-seater motor sports stadium is confident that the race in
September is going to match last year’s spectacle, with the race won by a
breathtaking overtaking move on the last corner of the last lap.
>On Wed, 17 Jul 2002 18:45:37 +0100, "The Right Honourable Mr-FiXXXer²ºº² ESQ" <mrfixxxerNOS…@bigfoot.com> wrote:
><his crap snipped>
Why is RaceFax’s information "crap" when it said EXACTLY the same
thing as the press release you show below?
Just scroll down and take a look and you will see.
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
>From http://www.rockingham.co.uk
>ROCKINGHAM 500 RACE WILL GO AHEAD, PLEDGES TRACK BOSS
>Following today’s announcement that the Eurospeedway Lausitz track will not
>be hosting a German round of the FedEx CART Championship racing series this
>year, David Grace the Chief Executive of Rockingham Motor Speedway pledged
>that the British race will go ahead on September 14. The race on the banked
>1.5-mile oval track near Corby in Northamptonshire last year attracted over
>42,000 spectators to see the fastest motor race in Europe.
>"I feel very sorry for all the team at EuroSpeedway Lausitz" said Grace. "I
>know from our own experience just how hard they will have worked to try to
>make the race a success. It is a tragedy that the German government
>officials were unable to offer financial support to this a world-class
>event. On the brighter side, as the sole venue in Europe this year, for the
>fastest racing in the world, we are already making plans with CART and
>EuroSpeedway to be able to welcome many of the German race fans to
>Rockingham instead."
>Rockingham’s plans are forging ahead, with over half the seats in one of the
>track’s biggest grandstands allocated in the past fortnight alone
From RaceFax:
"Earlier today, CART announced that Rockingham had reduced ticket
prices for the Rockingham 500 (note, no event title sponsor) and
established half-price ticketing for children, and that the changes
resulted in the sale of half of the 7,000 seats in the South
Grandstand. How many of those were discounted child tickets was not
stated."
Doesn’t that say that "half" of the grandstand in question has been
sold?
And don’t forget to notice who RaceFax’s "source" was. None other than
CART itself!
> and less
>than a dozen of the track’s 58 corporate hospitality suites remaining.
From RaceFax:
"The release also stated that 13,000 tickets had been sold previously,
and that less than 12 of 58 corporate hospitality suites remained
unbooked. Two months remain before the race, but considering the
sanction fee and air freight cost, and the current ticket sales of
16,500, the picture is not overly promising."
Your track press release says less than a dozen" hospitality suites
and RaceFax says "less than 12." What’s the difference? Why is one
"crap" and the other not "crap?"
>The 52,000 place, all-seater motor sports stadium is confident that the race in
>September is going to match last year’s spectacle, with the race won by a
>breathtaking overtaking move on the last corner of the last lap.
Remember, RaceFax pulled its stuff from a CART press release. It says
so right in the text if you bothered to read it. Now it doesn’t take a
mental giant to do the math from Rockingham.
13,000 seats had been sold until they opened up this other grandstand
and cut kids prices in half, and that’s according to CART itself.
Half of that 7,000 capacity grandstand sells, and no one knows how
many of those were the half-price kid seats, but half of 7,000 is
still 3.500, even on this newsgroup.
Add 3,500 to 13,000 and you get 16,500 seats sold. The place has
seating for 52,000. You do the math.
So, RaceFax quotes a CART release and it is "crap" but you quote a
Rockingham press release and its not?
Gary
"Arguing on the internet is like running in the
Special Olympics. Even if you do win, you’re still
retarded."
"Gary Ghezzi" <gghe…@NOSPAMyahoo.com> wrote in message
news:3d3658b3.99385248@news-east.teranews.com…
> >On Wed, 17 Jul 2002 18:45:37 +0100, "The Right Honourable Mr-FiXXXer²ºº²
ESQ" <mrfixxxerNOS…@bigfoot.com> wrote:
> ><his crap snipped>
> Remember, RaceFax pulled its stuff from a CART press release. It says
> so right in the text if you bothered to read it. Now it doesn’t take a
> mental giant to do the math from Rockingham.
> 13,000 seats had been sold until they opened up this other grandstand
> and cut kids prices in half, and that’s according to CART itself.
All of the grandstands were opened up at the same time, when the tickets
originally went on sale. The pricing structure has also not changed since
that time.
RaceFax:
"Earlier today, CART announced that Rockingham had reduced ticket
prices for the Rockingham 500 (note, no event title sponsor) and
established half-price ticketing for children"
Press release on CART.com:
"The new oval track lowered ticket prices and instituted a half-price plan
for children that has met with quick acceptance from the British fans."
CART didn’t just suddenly announce out of the blue it the other day, they
merely mentioned something which had been the case since the beginning of
2002 sales.
> Half of that 7,000 capacity grandstand sells, and no one knows how
> many of those were the half-price kid seats, but half of 7,000 is
> still 3.500, even on this newsgroup.
> Add 3,500 to 13,000 and you get 16,500 seats sold. The place has
> seating for 52,000. You do the math.
There are still what, eight weeks until the event? Loads of time.
Pat
On Thu, 18 Jul 2002 06:10:31 GMT, gghe…@NOSPAMyahoo.com (Gary
Ghezzi) wrote:
>>On Wed, 17 Jul 2002 18:45:37 +0100, "The Right Honourable Mr-FiXXXer²ºº² ESQ" <mrfixxxerNOS…@bigfoot.com> wrote:
>><his crap snipped>
>Why is RaceFax’s information "crap" when it said EXACTLY the same
>thing as the press release you show below?
That’s the "refuse to acknowledge facts" part that makes up 33% of
CHUMPS.
Cheers, TA
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
>Just scroll down and take a look and you will see.
>>From http://www.rockingham.co.uk
>>ROCKINGHAM 500 RACE WILL GO AHEAD, PLEDGES TRACK BOSS
>>Following today’s announcement that the Eurospeedway Lausitz track will not
>>be hosting a German round of the FedEx CART Championship racing series this
>>year, David Grace the Chief Executive of Rockingham Motor Speedway pledged
>>that the British race will go ahead on September 14. The race on the banked
>>1.5-mile oval track near Corby in Northamptonshire last year attracted over
>>42,000 spectators to see the fastest motor race in Europe.
>>"I feel very sorry for all the team at EuroSpeedway Lausitz" said Grace. "I
>>know from our own experience just how hard they will have worked to try to
>>make the race a success. It is a tragedy that the German government
>>officials were unable to offer financial support to this a world-class
>>event. On the brighter side, as the sole venue in Europe this year, for the
>>fastest racing in the world, we are already making plans with CART and
>>EuroSpeedway to be able to welcome many of the German race fans to
>>Rockingham instead."
>>Rockingham’s plans are forging ahead, with over half the seats in one of the
>>track’s biggest grandstands allocated in the past fortnight alone
>From RaceFax:
>"Earlier today, CART announced that Rockingham had reduced ticket
>prices for the Rockingham 500 (note, no event title sponsor) and
>established half-price ticketing for children, and that the changes
>resulted in the sale of half of the 7,000 seats in the South
>Grandstand. How many of those were discounted child tickets was not
>stated."
>Doesn’t that say that "half" of the grandstand in question has been
>sold?
>And don’t forget to notice who RaceFax’s "source" was. None other than
>CART itself!
>> and less
>>than a dozen of the track’s 58 corporate hospitality suites remaining.
>From RaceFax:
>"The release also stated that 13,000 tickets had been sold previously,
>and that less than 12 of 58 corporate hospitality suites remained
>unbooked. Two months remain before the race, but considering the
>sanction fee and air freight cost, and the current ticket sales of
>16,500, the picture is not overly promising."
>Your track press release says less than a dozen" hospitality suites
>and RaceFax says "less than 12." What’s the difference? Why is one
>"crap" and the other not "crap?"
>>The 52,000 place, all-seater motor sports stadium is confident that the race in
>>September is going to match last year’s spectacle, with the race won by a
>>breathtaking overtaking move on the last corner of the last lap.
>Remember, RaceFax pulled its stuff from a CART press release. It says
>so right in the text if you bothered to read it. Now it doesn’t take a
>mental giant to do the math from Rockingham.
>13,000 seats had been sold until they opened up this other grandstand
>and cut kids prices in half, and that’s according to CART itself.
>Half of that 7,000 capacity grandstand sells, and no one knows how
>many of those were the half-price kid seats, but half of 7,000 is
>still 3.500, even on this newsgroup.
>Add 3,500 to 13,000 and you get 16,500 seats sold. The place has
>seating for 52,000. You do the math.
>So, RaceFax quotes a CART release and it is "crap" but you quote a
>Rockingham press release and its not?
>Gary
>"Arguing on the internet is like running in the
>Special Olympics. Even if you do win, you’re still
>retarded."
I wish CART could just work out a deal with the folks at Hockenheim, and
have them run at the "old" course. The F1 guys can run on the new modified
course.
If the F1 cars can hit 220 three times on the old route, I’m wondering what
the Champcars could do….
"Gary Ghezzi" <gghe…@NOSPAMyahoo.com> wrote in message
news:3d361efa.84608330@news-east.teranews.com…
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
> Lausitzring Is Gone, Rockingham’s At Risk
> After spending some time today notifying sponsors, CART has formally
> announced the cancellation of the German 500 at the Eurospeedway.
> The track was already in receivership, and the receiver today (July
> 16th) notified CART he had pulled the plug. For those who might be
> more familiar with the American terms, receivership means bankruptcy,
> and the receiver is the referee or trustee.
> Gone with the race is a sanction fee estimated at $4.2 million, that
> estimate based on the assumption that the German organizers got the
> same deal as their British counterparts at Rockingham. CART had
> earlier this year become a co-promoter of the event in an attempt to
> keep it afloat, but that arrangement evidently only deferred a
> portion of the sanction fee, against recovering it later from ticket
> sales, plus a percentage of profits after a certain level.
> The announcement was in stark contrast to assurances understandably
> provided by CART president Chris Pook on July 6th, when he said,
> "VP of promoter relations, Tim Mayer, was in Lausitz this week, and
> we have met with the bankruptcy referee…and we have arrived at a
> good, solid working relationship to get that event underway. We feel
> confident about it."
> The cancellation of the German event also bodes ill for Rockingham.
> The tracks split the $1.2 million FedEx charge for air-freighting the
> cars and equipment overseas. In the short term, CART is now likely
> to take a hit for the Eurospeedway’s $600,000 portion of that bill,
> and it seems wildly optimistic to suggest that Rockingham can stand
> the entire cost in 2003. Adjustments to the 2003 race calendar,
> which Pook had promised to distribute this week, are now an
> inevitability, and 20 races seems unlikely, at best. Further, if
> both races are off the calendar next year, the FedEx series title
> sponsorship will also be at risk, as FedEx has turned a modest profit
> on the arrangement, through the air freight charges for CART’s
> overseas races.
> CART’s projected 2002 earnings will be further reduced by the
> Eurospeedway sanction fee. Again based on the Rockingham contract, a
> payment of $661,500 was due to CART on January 1, 2002, but it seems
> a reasonable assumption, given the co-promotion scheme, that the
> payment was not made. If it was, CART is still likely to be out the
> remaining $3.5 million, and with the air freight contribution now all
> but certain, the total will exceed $4 million in lost revenue.
> Two weeks ago, Pook said that CART remained, "committed to the
> European races," and today’s statement said the company will, "shift
> our European focus to other markets." Similar statements were made
> about the Japanese market after Motegi was lost to the Indy Racing
> League, but no replacement race there will be on the 2003 calendar.
> Given CART’s lack of presence in Europe and England outside the races
> there, plus the failure of what was the Lausitzring, and what is
> likely to happen at Rockingham, we would expect shortly to begin to
> hear a lot more from CART about NAFTA, and a lot less about the EU.
> Earlier today, CART announced that Rockingham had reduced ticket
> prices for the Rockingham 500 (note, no event title sponsor) and
> established half-price ticketing for children, and that the changes
> resulted in the sale of half of the 7,000 seats in the South
> Grandstand. How many of those were discounted child tickets was not
> stated.
> The release also stated that 13,000 tickets had been sold previously,
> and that less than 12 of 58 corporate hospitality suites remained
> unbooked. Two months remain before the race, but considering the
> sanction fee and air freight cost, and the current ticket sales of
> 16,500, the picture is not overly promising.
> Further, we are reliably informed that CART has found it necessary to
> become a co-promoter of the Rockingham race, which means that the
> company stands some of the financial risk involved in the event.
> The potential risk may be better defined when CART unveils its second
> quarter performance. That period included the Chicago race, held on
> June 30th. CART was the sole promoter, and the race drew a claimed
> 25,000 spectators. Fortunately for shareholders, in a sense, CART
> spent little on promotion, and thus had less to recover from ticket
> revenue. The quarterly report should also provide some insight into
> the financial viability of the new-for-2002 television arrangements.
> (from RaceFax.com)
> Gary
> "Arguing on the internet is like running in the
> Special Olympics. Even if you do win, you’re still
> retarded."
"J.L." <f1c…@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:ah7gkh$4c9$1@mailgate2.lexis-nexis.com…
> I wish CART could just work out a deal with the folks at Hockenheim, and
> have them run at the "old" course. The F1 guys can run on the new modified
> course.
> If the F1 cars can hit 220 three times on the old route, I’m wondering
what
> the Champcars could do….
That would be fine, if the old course hadn’t been ripped up…
Pat
"Pat W" <p…@f1ngers.com> writes:
>That would be fine, if the old course hadn’t been ripped up…
As I understand it the old track is still there – it was even an option
this year if they didn’t get the new track done in time.
–
—
Eric Bin – w…@supafamous.com – http://www.supafamous.com
I hope they didn’t tear up the part where "pancho man" appeared…
Why would they tear up the old part of the track? To plant trees?
Man, I love it when these historic circuits leave the old track as it was,
so you can see how things used to be. (like Monza for ie)
"Eric Bin" <e…@sfu.ca> wrote in message
news:ah7mfk$mji$1@morgoth.sfu.ca…
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
> "Pat W" <p…@f1ngers.com> writes:
> >That would be fine, if the old course hadn’t been ripped up…
> As I understand it the old track is still there – it was even an option
> this year if they didn’t get the new track done in time.
> —
> —
> Eric Bin – w…@supafamous.com – http://www.supafamous.com
> As I understand it the old track is still there – it was even an option
> this year if they didn’t get the new track done in time.
Nope!
The old course is gone.
Sorry for no better news.
Joerg
"J.L." <f1c…@nospamhotmail.com> wrote:
> Why would they tear up the old part of the track? To plant trees?
Yup. They had to agree to give the old parts back to nature to be allowed to
build the new parts.
"J.L." <f1c…@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:ah7gkh$4c9$1@mailgate2.lexis-nexis.com…
> I wish CART could just work out a deal with the folks at Hockenheim, and
> have them run at the "old" course. The F1 guys can run on the new modified
> course.
> If the F1 cars can hit 220 three times on the old route, I’m wondering
what
> the Champcars could do….
Simple!!
Crash in turn one.
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
> "Gary Ghezzi" <gghe…@NOSPAMyahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:3d361efa.84608330@news-east.teranews.com…
> > Lausitzring Is Gone, Rockingham’s At Risk
> > After spending some time today notifying sponsors, CART has formally
> > announced the cancellation of the German 500 at the Eurospeedway.
> > The track was already in receivership, and the receiver today (July
> > 16th) notified CART he had pulled the plug. For those who might be
> > more familiar with the American terms, receivership means bankruptcy,
> > and the receiver is the referee or trustee.
> > Gone with the race is a sanction fee estimated at $4.2 million, that
> > estimate based on the assumption that the German organizers got the
> > same deal as their British counterparts at Rockingham. CART had
> > earlier this year become a co-promoter of the event in an attempt to
> > keep it afloat, but that arrangement evidently only deferred a
> > portion of the sanction fee, against recovering it later from ticket
> > sales, plus a percentage of profits after a certain level.
> > The announcement was in stark contrast to assurances understandably
> > provided by CART president Chris Pook on July 6th, when he said,
> > "VP of promoter relations, Tim Mayer, was in Lausitz this week, and
> > we have met with the bankruptcy referee…and we have arrived at a
> > good, solid working relationship to get that event underway. We feel
> > confident about it."
> > The cancellation of the German event also bodes ill for Rockingham.
> > The tracks split the $1.2 million FedEx charge for air-freighting the
> > cars and equipment overseas. In the short term, CART is now likely
> > to take a hit for the Eurospeedway’s $600,000 portion of that bill,
> > and it seems wildly optimistic to suggest that Rockingham can stand
> > the entire cost in 2003. Adjustments to the 2003 race calendar,
> > which Pook had promised to distribute this week, are now an
> > inevitability, and 20 races seems unlikely, at best. Further, if
> > both races are off the calendar next year, the FedEx series title
> > sponsorship will also be at risk, as FedEx has turned a modest profit
> > on the arrangement, through the air freight charges for CART’s
> > overseas races.
> > CART’s projected 2002 earnings will be further reduced by the
> > Eurospeedway sanction fee. Again based on the Rockingham contract, a
> > payment of $661,500 was due to CART on January 1, 2002, but it seems
> > a reasonable assumption, given the co-promotion scheme, that the
> > payment was not made. If it was, CART is still likely to be out the
> > remaining $3.5 million, and with the air freight contribution now all
> > but certain, the total will exceed $4 million in lost revenue.
> > Two weeks ago, Pook said that CART remained, "committed to the
> > European races," and today’s statement said the company will, "shift
> > our European focus to other markets." Similar statements were made
> > about the Japanese market after Motegi was lost to the Indy Racing
> > League, but no replacement race there will be on the 2003 calendar.
> > Given CART’s lack of presence in Europe and England outside the races
> > there, plus the failure of what was the Lausitzring, and what is
> > likely to happen at Rockingham, we would expect shortly to begin to
> > hear a lot more from CART about NAFTA, and a lot less about the EU.
> > Earlier today, CART announced that Rockingham had reduced ticket
> > prices for the Rockingham 500 (note, no event title sponsor) and
> > established half-price ticketing for children, and that the changes
> > resulted in the sale of half of the 7,000 seats in the South
> > Grandstand. How many of those were discounted child tickets was not
> > stated.
> > The release also stated that 13,000 tickets had been sold previously,
> > and that less than 12 of 58 corporate hospitality suites remained
> > unbooked. Two months remain before the race, but considering the
> > sanction fee and air freight cost, and the current ticket sales of
> > 16,500, the picture is not overly promising.
> > Further, we are reliably informed that CART has found it necessary to
> > become a co-promoter of the Rockingham race, which means that the
> > company stands some of the financial risk involved in the event.
> > The potential risk may be better defined when CART unveils its second
> > quarter performance. That period included the Chicago race, held on
> > June 30th. CART was the sole promoter, and the race drew a claimed
> > 25,000 spectators. Fortunately for shareholders, in a sense, CART
> > spent little on promotion, and thus had less to recover from ticket
> > revenue. The quarterly report should also provide some insight into
> > the financial viability of the new-for-2002 television arrangements.
> > (from RaceFax.com)
> > Gary
> > "Arguing on the internet is like running in the
> > Special Olympics. Even if you do win, you’re still
> > retarded."